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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Dec 12, 2010 10:37:24 GMT -5
This really bothers me, and I can no longer stay silent. People should already know my views by now about all the conspiracy theories from comments I make at the forum or elsewhere. Who knows why fans come up with this stuff? I understand their anger and that they want justice for Michael, but to find blame with Sony, AEG, his family, his friends, his lawyers and past collaborators all in his honor? No, that’s just wrong.
What irks me so much is the Sony boycott that MJ “fans” insist on carrying out, especially now for Michael’s new album. Thankfully, their boycott will hardly affect his album sales, which will go straight to #1 as soon as it’s released, if not sooner. And I couldn’t be more thrilled! However, it’s those so-called fans with their outlandish claims that Sony killed Michael that bug the hell out of me. So they refuse to buy his album. Do they not understand that if they boycott the album, they are boycotting Michael? Would Michael want his fans to refuse to buy his music on these grounds? Of course not! Michael was a recording artist who loved creating music for his fans. He would be thrilled (and I know he is) that his fans are so happy to hear his new music! He would be thrilled to know his album will go straight to #1 and the whole world (including the critics) will re-discover his amazing talent. It’s an incredible tribute to his legacy, one that we fans are so proud of. Michael will continue to break music industry records for years to come, and he would be ecstatic about that
So did Sony kill Michael? Of course not. A bad doctor did, a very greedy, incompetent, careless and deceitful doctor took Michael’s life. And we have every right to hope for justice and hear the truth come out, to see this man go to prison for as long as possible. So why are some fans blaming Sony for Michael’s downfall? Because of his beef with them in 2001, regarding their non-promotion of Invincible? That was Tommy Motolla’s decision, who was the head of the Sony division at the time. Soon after Michael’s campaign against Sony, Motolla was fired. The damage had unfortunately been done by then, but Michael moved past it and worked with Sony again in 2005 releasing the Thriller 25 Anniversary album, and planned to work with Sony again on future promotions with the This Is It concerts. He wanted fans to BUY Invincible, not boycott Sony and NOT buy it! That’s just stupid.
So why do fans still want to boycott Sony? And therefore, boycott Michael’s album. They are obviously sadly misguided, and led down the wrong path by people they trust who come up with wild but possibly believable accusations. Sound familiar? These same so-called “fans” who rightly don’t believe the child molestation accusations are accusing Sony and so many others because of unconfirmed and unverifiable half-truths. I would hate to see these people in a jury box!
Another reason they have is that Michael was keeping all of his recordings for his children as part of his legacy. Well of course he was! They will profit from his album sales and all other MJ products for the rest of their lives. Prince, Paris and Blanket are now set for life, which was Michael’s plan thanks to his last will and testament!
Will.i.am and Akon have both said they will never release any of the music they worked on with Michael, which is fine, if that is their conviction. I personally don’t agree, but then they aren’t asking my opinion, are they? My belief is that Michael did not mean to keep every song he ever worked on locked up in a vault forever. He was planning to either release them, or give them to other artists, or whatever. But his best work, including classical music recordings, would eventually come out for his fans to enjoy.
Probably what bothers me the MOST is that these same boycotting fans are hypocrites! And I hate hypocrites! They refuse to buy his album, but guess what? Right now they are all listening to it! Do you see something wrong with this picture? In my mind, you are either FOR Michael’s album or you are AGAINST it. There should be no half-boycott nonsense. If they feel that strongly about Sony, why are they listening to the new music that Sony is putting out? This reminds me of Friday night at Marty’s MJ show, when one of these fans came in denouncing Sony, but yet we were listening to the new album at the time. So I asked him why was he there? He doesn’t want Michael to be #1 on the charts! Is this really a fan? No, of course not. Just some misguided idiot who has bought into the notion to boycott Sony without thinking it through. Another story comes to mind about the Hold My Hand video, released by Sony. One well known boycotter from an MJ justice group showed up for the recent video shoot to participate, and was rightly called out about it by a member of JUSTICE4MJ who was also there to participate, celebrate and honor Michael’s legacy. This boycotter sheepishly left the shoot, but do you see what I mean? Hypocrisy runs rampant and it’s downright ridiculous.
You are either FOR Michael or you are AGAINST him. Which is it? Next time you come across a boycotter, please ask them that.
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 12, 2010 12:04:35 GMT -5
I join you in this rant! Whereever i go to listen to Michael's new songs, I see fans or let me say; enemies encourage fans to download the album and not buy it, of some reasons i go nutz over. Either, they say, the tracks are fake and/or Sony killed Michael.
I was about to type something about it on this forum earlier, but I do not trust my english enough to type too much on a board. Neither way, we might also send a "thank you" to the same person who tried to throw Charles Thomson off the net. Her name is Bonnie Cox. I know many fans followed her, just to read about her extremely hate against Sony. Not that I love all these giant companies myself, but this is business as we all know.
Let me Quote something from her blog; "The only way to stop them is to keep writing letters and for the love of Michael, stop buying his music! Do not buy anything that Sony is a part of. Check the labels before buying anything. Stop supporting the evil!"
Excuse me, is that a fan? For the love of Michael we're supposed to stop buying his music?! No, she admits she never believed she would type about Michael Jackson. Sony is her target for one or another reason i don't care. What I do care about is all the damage this lady from the Tea Party already have done inside the fan-community with her conspiracy theories. Sorry, i just HAD to bring up this lady's name, because I felt it necessary as a part to warn fans. Michael believed in love, not in hate.
Fans who want to boycott Michael's voice and help to ruin his legacy are not seeing straight. I think many "boycotters" lack information and knowledge. But please keep spreading the words!
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Post by keepthefaith58 on Dec 12, 2010 14:17:57 GMT -5
Amen, Mal! Last week, after the album was pirated and posted on the web, Sony decided to stream it on MJ.com, which I believe was a wise choice. They didn't leave it up there more than a day or so, I believe, because now it's gone from there. However, there is another MJ site on FB that is still streaming the tracks. When you click on the individual songs, it takes you to another place to play the video, and there are comments below. Most of the comments, I have noticed, are from fans in Europe (so perhaps this page is based there), but almost all of the comments are negative...boycott Sony, don't buy this album, this is not Michael, FAKE!, Sony killed Michael for this music and on and on. It saddens me to see Michael's "FANS" saying things like this. Yes, I believe Sony is greedy, but they are a business. Do I think they killed Michael? Hell no. Those in the "fan community" who continue to spew their hatred and spread their brand of "Justice for Michael" are tearing us apart. Michael would not want his Army divided in this way. We should be united under him in LOVE and harmony instead of this ugliness currently so rampant. Fans who choose to only illegally download the songs from the web will not ultimately damage the total success of this album...I believe it will be #1 on its own merits, and will bring many new fans to Michael. But those who refuse to buy the album because they are against Sony and what it stands for are essentially taking a stand AGAINST MICHAEL. And ultimately, they are the ones who will lose. I, for one, will continue to purchase the new music that is distributed by Sony because I believe that Michael meant to share his creations with us, his fans. I am not Pro Sony, but I am PRO MICHAEL, and always will be.
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 12, 2010 15:05:34 GMT -5
I have lost it. I am loosing my temper. I need to chill. Have the fans forgot what Michael been through? Have they forgot all about the Chandler-family, Arvizos, Bashir, Sneddons/fake accusations about Child Abuse? That was the drop for Michael, these allegations weakend him. Not SONY! He could at least fight Sony, but he could never fight a rumour he got for lifetime even if he was innocent and aquitted. The real Army for Michael is here to defend him, keep his legacy alive, hit back on media and fake rumours. I haven't seen the boycott-fans so eager to fight back on Kelvin MacKenzie as they are against Sony. These hippocrits keep on listening to his music and are negative in their comments all over.
Yes, Sony is pure business, difficult to turn them into a welfare company. These protests seems fake/weird, plain stupid, and i am not sure everybody are fans.
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 12, 2010 15:34:00 GMT -5
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Post by divastyle on Dec 12, 2010 18:00:25 GMT -5
This is very aggravating, I myself agonized over getting his CD, I finally decided to pre-order it and am currently waiting for it to arrive.
I'm not into all the conspiracies, but I do believe that Sony had alot to do with Michael's downfall. He said himself that the day he became a part owner of Sony, the first molestation charge came out, I don't think that's a coincedence either.
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 12, 2010 23:24:01 GMT -5
I am not able to see a link between Sony and the fake accusations. If i recall right, the accusers name was Evan Chandler, who was greedy for money. When people start all these conspiracy theories, that's when it goes so wrong. Michael Jackson himself had to deal with such conspiracis his entire life.
I am not defending Sony for their behaviour back when Michael had a beef with mainly Tommy Mottola during 2001/2002, when he got support from his fans. But he would never encourage fans today to stop buying his music. He never did. In 2008 Thriller 25 was released on CD and DVD.
Why did fans buy everything from Sony while he was alive, and all of a sudden, now it's a fanbase around screaming for a boycott? We supported him and bought his music because he never encouraged the fans to boycott. Now that he is gone, killed by dr. Murray, fans target the company instead of target the man who took Michael Jackson's life. Even if Tommy Mottola might have been a devil, doesn't mean people working in music-companies are plain evil cynical non-human beings. He did quit his post in 2003 as the chairman in Sony, the company did not renew his contract, so i guess it's right he was fired.
All I care for now is Michael Jackson's estate and Legacy, his Estate will benefit his mother Katherine and his 3 kids.
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Post by karencanada on Dec 14, 2010 23:33:37 GMT -5
I have only one thing to say to this whole rant, which is thank you for your very hurtful, and extremely judgmental small minded opinions about people who have followed their hearts, their own research, and make their own conclusions, exactly as you have. HOw very very rude, judgmental and not at ALL about love, not at all.
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Post by karencanada on Dec 14, 2010 23:43:53 GMT -5
RE: "Those in the "fan community" who continue to spew their hatred and spread their brand of "Justice for Michael" are tearing us apart. Michael would not want his Army divided in this way. We should be united under him in LOVE and harmony instead of this ugliness currently so rampant.
Well yes exactly, this whole thread is a spewing of hatred and disharmony.
Before you speak, or write, ask yourself: Is it true, is it kind, is it necessary, does it improve on the silence? I don't believe any of this was necessary, one person judging another for their understanding and opinion, and of all ridiculous things, judging whether they are a true fan or not...it's pretty unreal, and very disappointing.
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Post by karencanada on Dec 14, 2010 23:51:22 GMT -5
# Please treat others as you wish to be treated. # Please handle differences of opinion with dignity and respect. these are the first two rules in the rules of conduct; it is truly a shame to see this site turning into such a travesty of what it began as.
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Post by karencanada on Dec 15, 2010 0:32:08 GMT -5
My last comment; how many reports and videos do there need to be of MJ saying that he would be killed over his music catalogue, and how many times must a Jackson family member say that Dr. Murray was the fall guy and that many others are behind it, before you will hear their words? Do you honestly believe it was just some incompetent Dr who left him unattended, who maybe accidentally cranked the heat up to 90-something in the room to hide the lividity in MJ's corpse, and moved him, and hid bottles of propofol etc etc...just an incompetent DR? The thing is, every one of us has probably watched hundreds of videos and every one of us follows up on the ones that strike a chord of truth for us, and realistically, strike a chord with what we want to believe. And I mean every single one of us, it's human nature, we seek confirmation for our beliefs. Hopefully, we also seek with an open mind and especially, with an open heart. There is a plethora of information for and about every possible scenario, and not one of us has any more access to that information than the other, or the inside scoop; the only person who knows what truly happened is Dr Conrad Murray and not one of us is his confidante. Occasionally we get passionate about what we think we know and what we believe, but to throw this kind of abuse out at anyone with different convictions is very negative, very sad. There was a previous post from MAL talking about how this site is free of judgement and that we all agree to disagree, but MAL when you use this forum and your influence as a moderator to pass judgement on others' convictions, then those words are no longer true. I will no longer be visiting this site, and I'm sorry to lose some of the lovely people I've met here. I am full of gratitude for the connections that we did make; for the love that has been expressed here in the past, for the initial spiritual aspect that brought us all together, and I know on a soul-level that each of us has experienced incredible insight, self-understanding, and life-lessons because of Michael, and that he brought us all together in those experiences. My gratitude and love will always be with all of you for that. Karen
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Post by judith51 on Dec 19, 2010 16:02:24 GMT -5
You are absolutley right Karen. Sorry to see you go.
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 20, 2010 17:23:28 GMT -5
My last comment; how many reports and videos do there need to be of MJ saying that he would be killed over his music catalogue, and how many times must a Jackson family member say that Dr. Murray was the fall guy and that many others are behind it, before you will hear their words? I am not very good in typing english but: Are you referring to LaToya Jackson? How much can one trust her when CNN reported she was paid for that interview? I remember she went out against her own brother telling the entire world her own brother acted inappropriately with children. She later told that her husband forced her to say this. I didn't believe her then, and i have no reason to trust her now. I am sure she is grieving, and she might believe Murray was the fall guy, but she did not tell who "they", the murders are. That is not the case for a part of the fancommunity. They have concluded Sony killed Michael Jackson. But where are the facts? Tabloid trash, over and over again. Speculations and lies. What i remember from Michael Jackson was alive, people did treat him with disrespect all the time, he was a big joke to them. As a fan it did hurt to see how people treated him. The superstar he was, it is not uncommon they recieve death-threats, and he might have said someone was trying to kill him to get his catalogues. But the fact remain: we do not know who threatned him, even if many already have concluded it must have been Sony. I find it weird that someone think it is ok to sit day and night making drama over conspiracy-theories and expect other fans to remain silent. You did judge the owner of this forum now, for speaking out, at the same time you accuse other fans to jugde the boycotters. There are no evidence whatsover that Michael Jackson was killed by Sony. These are accusations, a conspiracy theory, like many fans believe he is still alive, or that Illuminati killed him. Have a nice day.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Dec 21, 2010 8:26:22 GMT -5
My last comment; how many reports and videos do there need to be of MJ saying that he would be killed over his music catalogue, and how many times must a Jackson family member say that Dr. Murray was the fall guy and that many others are behind it, before you will hear their words? Do you honestly believe it was just some incompetent Dr who left him unattended, who maybe accidentally cranked the heat up to 90-something in the room to hide the lividity in MJ's corpse, and moved him, and hid bottles of propofol etc etc...just an incompetent DR? The thing is, every one of us has probably watched hundreds of videos and every one of us follows up on the ones that strike a chord of truth for us, and realistically, strike a chord with what we want to believe. And I mean every single one of us, it's human nature, we seek confirmation for our beliefs. Hopefully, we also seek with an open mind and especially, with an open heart. There is a plethora of information for and about every possible scenario, and not one of us has any more access to that information than the other, or the inside scoop; the only person who knows what truly happened is Dr Conrad Murray and not one of us is his confidante. Occasionally we get passionate about what we think we know and what we believe, but to throw this kind of abuse out at anyone with different convictions is very negative, very sad. There was a previous post from MAL talking about how this site is free of judgement and that we all agree to disagree, but MAL when you use this forum and your influence as a moderator to pass judgement on others' convictions, then those words are no longer true. Karen, sorry to see you go... I really am. I'm so happy this forum was a good place for you when you needed it, to learn from, to grow, and I love you very much. This is the Rants board, where we are allowed to get angry, without bashing anyone in particular. You will notice I haven't done that... I have a strong opinion and I won't apologize for it or my words, just like you wouldn't. You have a right to post your opinion too, and then some of us will either disagree with you or support your views. As for the points you made, I will address them one by one. These are all MY opinions... I don't force anyone to believe the following. True, Michael was very paranoid, probably because he tied in his purchase of the catalogue with the start of the child molestation accusations. Plus the fact, as Iris noted, he probably received a LOT of death threats from the misguided public. So if that is the case, I wouldn't have blamed him for being paranoid, especially since he had people around him managing his career that he couldn't totally trust. I understand why some of the Jacksons believe Murray was just a fall guy. We have to remember they are all grieving so much... they've lost their beloved son and brother. So it's very natural and human for them to reach for any conclusion they can to blame others. They believe in a conspiracy, and I disagree with their conclusions. However, I will always support the Jacksons because they hurt more than we ever have or will. Yes, I believe a very incompetent Murray leaving Michael unattended and forgetting about his patient hooked up to a dangerous drug, was a tragic accident, and nothing more. Then Murray worked to cover up the evidence, including dropping a bottle of propofol on the floor, cranking up the heat to hide the exact time of death, lying to the paramedics, etc. All of this and more will come out at the upcoming preliminary trial or the jury trial... we will finally hear the evidence and the state's case against him. As for your allegation he was a hitman, tell me what Murray had to gain by going along with such a scheme? He will lose his career, will go to prison, is forever financially ruined and is one of the most hated doctors ever! You are right that none of us know what really happened... we weren't there and can't get inside Murray's head, or Michael's head! All we can do is gather information, do our research and come to our own conclusions. The problem is, it is the info out there that is faulty. I could point you to 2 excellent videos proclaiming the exact opposite conclusions! So what if someone comes across the wrong conclusion, but yet it sounds so plausible! And there are SO MANY who agree with it, including those that follow bloggers who post not only detailed history and facts, but also opinions formed from hearsay. Surely, anyone would be swayed if they only went one place to find their information. Heck, if I were to watch a few beLIEver videos, I would probably think twice about Michael's death too! Surprisingly, it's actually very easy to suggest an idea that sticks in someone's head. Above all Karen, I'm sorry you were offended. That was never my intention... I started this rant just to get my anger and frustration out. And what does your rant have to do with people buying Michael's album anyway? If they are that angry at Sony and refuse to buy Michael's album, then why are they going to a Sony website to listen to the music Sony is providing to them for free? It's clear they want it both ways. They are both FOR and AGAINST Michael, which doesn't make sense to me. Mal
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 22, 2010 6:45:06 GMT -5
Mal, would you please provide me with the links you mention?
Please look up a user named 'dllzz' and look at her tweets. According that user, both tajjackson3 who uttered he might buy the album on a trip, and all fans are "emptyheads", stupid, guilty and not 'true' fans if they buy the album. Some boycotters are extremists, also playing on other fans guilt by showing pictures of Michael when he looked tired.
This is why I am very careful who to follow on Twitter nowadays.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Dec 23, 2010 0:35:06 GMT -5
Sorry norild, I don't have those videos on hand and didn't save them. I have watched lots of videos with differing opinions so I know they are out there. I know someone posted one of the conspiracy videos here at the forum, but I couldn't tell you where Maybe just do a search on YT to find them.
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Post by Alicia on Dec 23, 2010 10:01:18 GMT -5
I agree Mary Ann. To boycott the album, to me, only hurts the estate-which means Michael's Mom, his Kids, and the Charities which will receive 20% of his estate once all the bills are settled. That's a LOT of money for charity!!! Anyway, as we know Sony not only owns Michael's label Epic, but a BUNCH of other record labels and video games and phones and stereo equipment and on and on. Would a boycotter boycott all of that too? Would you throw away your Xbox and games and your Sony CD player and clock radio? To be fair to Michael and the estate you would have to. So, although I can't tell anyone that how they feel is "wrong" at all, I would just say to see it from this viewpoint. I am sooo glad they released the CD, I love it- it's a treat to hear some of Michael's unreleased songs, and keep his art alive. And as we know from the demo songs on Michael's Ultimate Collection CD and DVD set, and from You Tube, an unreleased demo from Michael is like a precious GEM, and better that 99.9% of most recording artist's RELEASED music!!!!!
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Post by Alicia on Dec 23, 2010 10:10:44 GMT -5
And I forgot to add, I am glad that the CD is doing so well, I was worried at first that all the negative statements and controversy was going to hurt the sales so much that Sony would decide not to invest very much in any further presentations of Michael's unheard music, which made me feel apprehensive, because I LOVE finding and hearing and seeing new Michael and J5 stuff! It is amazing to me how MUCH there is out there of Michael. He worked so hard and did so much in his life here on Earth. I am glad that there is so much of what he did here for us to see and hear!! So, I do know that Sony is a for profit company, but really, why do most of us get up and go to work---FOR PROFIT!!! So........They need to make money so they can keep on providing the public great projects like This IS IT and Michael. This Is It brought a bunch of new fans and new respect for Michael, and yet some wanted that to be boycotted and not ever released. What a SHAME that would have been! So, I know that I am probably "preaching to the choir" but I wanted to say that anyway Sony needs to be very careful though, in the future, and really only use material that is totally verified as well, and not use any type of melodyne or autotune or anything which modifies Michael's voice in any way. In that respect, I agree with the controversy and hope that Sony takes note. They do NOT need to change or modify Michael's voice in any way-it is just PERFECT the way it is!!!!) When I found out from Mary Ann about how Teddy Riley had admitted he used a device to alter Michael's voice, which caused his vibrato on the 3 controversial songs to sound different than usual, (which they really did-I can see that now), I must say I lost a lot of respect for him for doing that. I mean, WHY would he do that? So yes, that makes me suspicious, and I see why others were/are too. This faux paux by him may prevent him from being used as a producer of Michael's "unfinished" songs in the future. We do not need any further events like the ones surrounding the controversial songs on the Michael CD. Didn't Taryl say he wanted to hear a copy of one of the raw songs, and someone said they had "erased" it from the hard drive? What The #$%^ If they did that, the person who did it should NOT handle Mike's music!!For sure! Has T Riley ever explained why he felt the need to alter Mike's voice? That is crazy. Don't alter Mike's voice. Wow!!!!That is not acceptable!! I don't understand that AT ALL!!!
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Post by divastyle on Dec 23, 2010 14:02:19 GMT -5
This is what I've heard Alicia, Teddy had to alter Michael's voice because the trax in question were so raw that the only way to get them in tune was to alter his voice. Now, I've always had my doubts about Breaking News being Michael, but I can't understand how Keep Your Head could be in question because that sounds just like Michael to me.
Is Teddy telling the truth? I guess we will never know but this is his explanation.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Dec 23, 2010 14:58:52 GMT -5
I agree with divastyle. Looks like Teddy had no other choice than to mechanically alter Michael's voice, otherwise he wouldn't. As much as we don't like he did that, I love all 3 songs so I'm glad they were included in the album. Dawn, go listen to a song by Jason Malachi, and then listen to Keep Your Head Up. The voice is VERY similar. I'm not saying it's Jason singing for sure... could be this James Porte guy we've never heard of. The bright side to all this is the boycott had NO effect at all!
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Post by divastyle on Dec 23, 2010 15:35:15 GMT -5
I'll havta go and listen to this Jason character when I have a chance, MAL.
As far as the SONY boycott, I did read an article implying that Michael isn't doing as well in the US because of the boycott. It debuted on Billboards chart at #3 and because it wasn't #1 the article blames the boycott and the fact that alot of celebs who knew or worked w/ Mike personally are not supporting the album.
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Post by Alicia on Dec 23, 2010 16:59:29 GMT -5
Divastyle, Maybe the best thing TR could do, or the Cascios, is to release the raw tapes of the songs. I would really like that a lot
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Post by divastyle on Dec 23, 2010 19:10:28 GMT -5
Divastyle, Maybe the best thing TR could do, or the Cascios, is to release the raw tapes of the songs. I would really like that a lot I would like that too Alicia!
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Dec 25, 2010 10:30:38 GMT -5
I've thought of that too... it would be GREAT if they would release the original demos. I read somewhere that someone in the studio deleted them! Now I don't know if that's true, but that would be a crying shame!
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norildMJ
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Post by norildMJ on Dec 28, 2010 17:57:38 GMT -5
I have never listened so much as now to the Jason Malachi guy, right after the leak of Breaking News. I heard his tribute to Michael, A Hero fell, and i am fraid to say, he do not have that similar voice. I know another guy, he's quite unknown, which have a natural clean voice, very similar to Michael. Because of all the controversy i could not feel connection to the voice of Michael . But, All of a sudden, i felt - "sensed" Michael (different people have different energies), on the album, and i am sure it is his voice 100%. It's so sad Michael is gone. He used to alter his own voice, just remember 2000 watts? Michael have a very versatile voice. But when Michael is not among us anymore on this planet earth, producers must be very careful to mess with his voice. But i am so happy our radio stations are playing Michael Jackson more often again, as a result of the new album. I believe "Behind the Mask" is one of the favorites already.
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