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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 2, 2011 11:37:40 GMT -5
Finally, we’re starting off the new year with Dr. Murray's preliminary hearing this week. We've waited much too long for Murray to finally answer in a court of law for his reckless actions, and on Tuesday, we will start to see the legal process. We'll finally get to hear important details on the prosecution's case against him, and I truly believe they have a very strong case! So even though it will be really difficult to hear Murray's lies and excuses, we need to remember he will be in the fight of his life, and will do or say anything to win. But he will not. We must have faith that Judge Pastor will decide after hearing all the evidence from both sides, to send Murray to a jury trial for the untimely death of Michael Joe Jackson. As I mentioned in my New Year’s email to members, MJ’s Army will of course be posting in this thread all the up-to-the-minute breaking news from the hearing, as well as reports from online media and the JUSTICE4MJ group, so be sure to come by daily for the latest! I will be posting breaking news on Twitter first, so please follow me there at MJsarmy1 This just in from the Hindustan Times… Prince will be called to testify for the defense! Very upsetting to know this, but unfortunately, we had to expect it. www.hindustantimes.com/Michael-Jackson-s-son-may-testify/H1-Article1-645584.aspxLet’s try to have faith that we will see justice! Mal
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Post by mjsiris on Jan 2, 2011 19:02:58 GMT -5
Let's hope it won't come to that, that none of the children will have to be involved. I have a feeling this is going to be hard for ME. So what will it feel like for the children, even if they will not have to testify!
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 3, 2011 13:38:15 GMT -5
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 4, 2011 6:02:44 GMT -5
I have good news! According to TMZ, Prince will not be called to testify at the hearing! In fact, they think that none of the family will be called, thank God. www.tmz.com/2011/01/03/michael-jacksons-son-will-not-be-witness-preliminary-hearing-conrad-murray-propofol/More good news from an expert on anesthesia... yes he is promoting his book, but still, he knows what he's talking about. www.prweb.com/releases/2011/01/prweb4935054.htmYesterday's interview with Thomas Mesereau on MSNBC: www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/40888902#40888902Finally, here is the Ustream channel for JUSTICE4MJ... it should be up and running every day of the hearing, and a great place to chat and get the latest from those members standing outside the courthouse. www.ustream.tv/channel/conrad-murray-back-in-courtI will pop in there myself so maybe I'll see you there! My username there is freebizy This JUST in from TMZ, about Kenny Ortega being a star witness for our side! This is great news! www.tmz.com/2011/01/04/michael-jackson-kenny-ortega-died-propofol-this-is-it-producer-star-witness-preliminary-hearing-manslaughter/#comments-anchorBy the way, Harvey Levin at TMZ has said they will be posting all day long what happens at the hearing too, and will keep adding to the report everyday, so this will be an excellent place to go to catch up on the news. Will of course be posting all of it for you. JUSTICE for Michael! Mal
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Post by judith51 on Jan 4, 2011 8:42:06 GMT -5
I have faith that everything will work in our beloved MJ's favor. I just feel it in my heart.
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Post by divastyle on Jan 4, 2011 11:32:38 GMT -5
I hope things work out for our side and Michael FINALLY gets the justice he deserves!!! I can't believe Murray is claiming MJ committed suicide!
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 4, 2011 19:43:56 GMT -5
Don't worry, Murray will be sent to trial for sure, if today is any indication! Murray absolutely LOST in court today, because this whole hearing will be 30 witnesses for the Prosecution going up one after another, with their horrible incriminating and damning evidence against Murray. I just spent the whole day, 8 hours, at the JUSTICE4MJ Ustream channel, and luckily for us, 5 of their members including Amy and Erin, got to go into the courtroom to listen. At breaks, they would call in to report on the latest, so I will share the following... Katherine, Jackie and LaToya showing up at the courthouse: CNN's article on the hearing: www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/01/04/california.conrad.murray.hearing/index.html?hpt=T2As promised, TMZ was there all day and reported on each witness: www.tmz.com/2011/01/04/michael-jackson-doctor-conrad-murray-preliminary-hearing-trial-witness-propofol-death/#continuedScroll to the bottom and read up... Kenny Ortega was the first witness. An interesting point that was not mentioned here... Kenny was asked if Karen Faye talked to him about Michael's health (her claim). He said, no he never talked to her! As you read it, I know it will be REALLY difficult for you. It was for us too The whole thing is so heartbreaking, but we have to be strong. Please feel free to comment or add any news items that look important.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 5, 2011 9:20:42 GMT -5
The latest article from CNN: www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/01/05/california.conrad.murray.hearing/index.html?hpt=T2I'm sure that the public are outraged about Murray, now that the truth is finally coming out. No longer any untrue media speculation and conjecture to bias the public against Michael... now finally, the media has to report the facts. And it's even worse than what we've always heard! Murray's level of incompetence and carelessness are mind boggling, and we fans are being put through the wringer! But I would like to ask that fans stop doing their own speculating, and only take what we hear in the courtroom as the truth, the final word. It's clear now, and there should be no more doubt, that AEG was not conspiring to take Michael down or do away with him! Today's proceedings start at 9:30 a.m. PST.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 5, 2011 20:20:34 GMT -5
Okay, today was another very difficult day. I spent most of the time at the JUSTICE4MJ Ustream channel, waiting for Erin's updates when they would take a break or for lunch, or at the end of the day. Today, Katherine, Joe, Janet, Randy, LaToya and Reebie showed up. At some points during the day, Katherine would be crying, and later her and Janet were visibly angry. Janet and Reebie couldn't take hearing it and left the courthouse midway. This is CNN's update from yesterday: www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/01/05/california.conrad.murray.hearing/index.htmlHere's an update from KTLA.com. It looks like they are not biased against Michael at all, so I'm happy to post their video. I will try to check their clip everyday. www.ktla.com/videobeta/8bdb7319-665c-4fcf-9417-1a876604c2b9/News/KTLA-Jackson-Doctor-Hearing-Continues-Eric-Spillman-ReportsAnd of course, the MJ page from TMZ! Yes, TMZ is dedicating this page solely to everything MJ, with all the reports from the hearing. Be sure to bookmark this page as they keep adding to it. www.tmz.com/2011/01/04/michael-jackson-doctor-conrad-murray-preliminary-hearing-trial-witness-propofol-death/#continuedYou will also see they included a video of the Jacksons arriving at court. Anyway, according to Erin, Murray's defense stood up and badgered the EMT, basically calling Michael a drug addict a few times and saying that's why the EMT didn't want to take Michael to the hospital. Very difficult to hear, but THIS is going to be solely Murray's defense, that Michael was a drug addict. Unfortunately, I heard that Janet was interviewed and she also admitted it, that Michael was an addict. So what she said doesn't help our side.
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Post by judith51 on Jan 6, 2011 8:52:36 GMT -5
Kudos to you Mary Ann for great updates for MJ's Army. Justice will finally prevail! My 53rd Birthday was the 3rd. Consequently, this is the best Birthday present for me - the evidence required for a swift and speedy trial for the conviction of that quack.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 6, 2011 9:09:53 GMT -5
Thanks very much, Judith! I have been consumed, as well as a few of the MJ groups who are also reporting on the hearing daily too. Be sure to follow me on Twitter for the latest if you haven't yet - MJsarmy1
I was watching CNN last nite and saw an interesting session with Anderson Cooper and his guests. It's their opinion that the Prosecution is going all out with their witnesses, with an overwhelming amount of incriminating evidence against Murray, to force his defense to request a plea deal. Very interesting! This would mean that Murray would have to change his plea to guilty, so that he could get a shorter prison sentence. If he did that, there would be NO trial and he would start his term in prison immediately.
Something to think about! I'm interested to know what fans would think if Murray's team were to go this way. In my opinion, if they were forced to make a deal, and change their plea to guilty, then this would be JUSTICE! Murray would just get a lighter sentence (not 4 years), but then, is 4 years or less enough time for him in prison? NO, none of us feel that way, but since that's all he could get according to the law, we would have to live with it.
By the way, I just caught Harvey Levin's answer to whether Prince will be called to testify at the TRIAL (not the hearing on now). He strongly believes that Prince will NOT be called by either side, because it would look really bad to a jury to call a 13-year old up to the stand for cross-examination, and to traumatize him further. I really hope he's right!
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Post by judith51 on Jan 6, 2011 9:33:23 GMT -5
Well, you know I will always give my opinion. Yes, any form of punishment behind bars would be ok with me. He will most likley lose his license to be a witch doctor. The man will have nothing left. Nothing the same the Jackson children are left with and Michael's family. Murray's defense is laughable and nothing short of a failed attempt to save his booty from the inevitable. Justice for Mj! God rest his gentle spirit and let it live on through Mj's Army. Love to all my sisters!
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 6, 2011 10:31:47 GMT -5
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Post by divastyle on Jan 6, 2011 13:22:08 GMT -5
I heard about Janet too and it does not matter if Mike was an addict or not, that is NOT the issue in this case, Murray is a freekin DOCTOR and was negligent! I don't care if Michael ordered propofol off a menu, you don't use a powerful drug like that outside of a hospital setting. I'm beginning to doubt if Murray is even a doctor at all!!
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Post by Melissa on Jan 6, 2011 16:46:13 GMT -5
You know, I've been wondering why I've been instinctually avoiding too much exposure to videos and articles on the hearing and potential trial, and after reading/viewing most of these links, I think I'm starting to formulate an answer.
I understand that all of this in necessary, that Murray needs to answer for his part in this tragedy, and that speculation and hearsay needs to be cleared up. I simply don't like what this necessity means for Michael and his family. The horrific details and intimacies made visible and audible for all the world. It's another -- necessary, I admit -- invasion of Michael at his most vulnerable.
I don't know. I suppose I'm avoiding exposing myself to it all out of respect. To read only what I need to know. It's hard to have statements (written or spoken) take me inside the moment of Michael's death. I'm eager for Murray to be handed the appropriate punishment so we can all return to focussing on Michael as he was in life, and how his legacy continues to live with us now.
Here's to getting to the other side. Love to you all.
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Post by mjsiris on Jan 6, 2011 18:31:13 GMT -5
I agree with you that if Murray changed his plea to guilty it would be justice, even if it meant a shorter jail sentence, since 4 years aren't nearly enough anyway. However, I have to admit that a part of me wants him to be imprisoned for as long as possible, wants him to go to trial, be judged by a jury and all that. I also think that it is irrelevant whether Michael was an addict or not, Murray should not have given him Propofol at all, end of story. Besides, from what I've read from the hearings it seems pretty clear that Murray was more concerned with covering up his own actions than saving Michael's life after he found him lifeless. He probably knew it was too late.
This is all just too sad and I really feel for Michael's family, having to go through this. the only good news is that the children probably will not have to testify, that's a relief.
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Post by judith51 on Jan 7, 2011 8:46:58 GMT -5
The likelihood of Murray even surviving in prison is questionble. I'm guessing he will not even make it a year in prison. He will get what he deserves loss of license and probably life in the end. There is alot of evidence now and the judge will not overlook this. I hate see Michael's Mom and family put through the ringer again and again. Think postive sisters there will be justice for Michael. I agree with Melissa I have tried not to watch images of court trial on the tube. However, I live so close to LA its unavoidable. I wait only to hear one phrase " guilty in the murder of Michael Joeseph Jackson". Involuntary manslaughter my -----
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 7, 2011 10:26:26 GMT -5
I agree, it does not matter whether Michael was a drug addict or not. What matters is that Murray killed him, being extremely incompetent, reckless, careless and uncaring, which is NOT what Michael hired him for! This is what Arnie Klein tweeted in April 2010: As Michael Jackson's physician for 25 years i can assure the world he could never self-inject. He was needle phobic. Thank you Arnie! I really hope he is called to testify at the trial, for the prosecution! Let's also remember how healthy Michael was, and how much he was looking forward to doing the concerts. The truth told here... Here's a link to the witnesses who have testified so far (and some with pre-trial notes): sprocket-trials.blogspot.com/2011/01/dr-conrad-murray-prelim-quick-links.htmlUnless you are there in the courtroom to hear it, TMZ is reporting the most comprehensive news from the witnesses: www.tmz.com/2011/01/04/michael-jackson-doctor-conrad-murray-preliminary-hearing-trial-witness-propofol-death/More from CNN, who is reporting everyday: www.cnn.com/2011/CRIME/01/07/california.conrad.murray.hearing/index.html?hpt=C2Murray's girlfriend to testify today, FOR the Prosecution! Interesting.
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Post by divastyle on Jan 7, 2011 12:08:45 GMT -5
Who knows what Klien would say though MAL, he is the 1 who called Michael gay remember? I believe he was telling the truth about the needles though, I've heard before that Michael was terrified of them!
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 8, 2011 10:13:46 GMT -5
The truth is Dawn, we don't know yet. Everyone really should try not to speculate, because I see a lot of people doing that, and that just leads to misinformation being spread around. It's going to get uglier next week, and I believe we will be hearing things about Michael we never knew, and don't WANT to hear This by far is the BEST coverage of the hearing from the Sprocket & Company blog: DAY 4 preliminary hearing coverage from T&T -- Part 1: tinyurl.com/2ffa6b4 Part 2: tinyurl.com/23j5m66We have lots of reading to catch up on this weekend! By the way, we have a list of Michael's subscriptions and their description, the dates they were prescribed and how many pills were left! Flomax is for the prostate... I am not going to even guess why Michael had it. www.twitlonger.com/show/808jngSome excellent reporting here!
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Post by divastyle on Jan 8, 2011 21:59:57 GMT -5
Oh I'm not speculating at all MAL, I'm just saying that I personally don't trust Klien.
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 9, 2011 23:00:00 GMT -5
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Post by MaryAnn Layton on Jan 12, 2011 14:28:59 GMT -5
What better way to end this thread than include the last day's testimony, and closing arguments! Wasn't it the 7th day? Hmmm, Michael's favorite number was 7... hmmm Notice the defense's closing arguments! They have NO case! ++++++ Summary of Conrad Murray Preliminary Hearing Day 6 (Last day) January 11, 2011 Dr. Christopher Rogers Testimony - Rogers is LA coroner. Employed since 1988 as a forensic pathologist and he performed the autopsy on MJ. - Rogers about MJ's health "The autopsy did show some incidental findings. However, his general health was excellent." - findings: MJ had prostate issue; vitillago, polop of the colon, inflammation and scaring of his lungs, and also had some arthritis of the spine. - MJ was 5’ 9” and 136 pounds. His BMI (body mass index) 20.1. It falls to the thin side of normal weight. - MJ did not have any abnormalities of the heart and he did not have any atherosclerosis. He did not have any cardiac disease. - There was no trauma or any natural disease that caused his death. - Rogers' conclusion of homicide was based primarily on the info he had about the medical care MJ received, specifically that the care was substandard. “The information we received indicates that the doctor left Mr. Jackson while he was anesthetized and this is something you would not do,” Roger said. - Rogers says MJ died of propofol intoxication, with an underlying condition of a benzodiazepine effect. - Cross-examination : Rogers say that situation doesn’t support self administration of self treatment of propofol and there were no factors inconsistent with his conclusions. - Cross-examination : Rogers is asked hypothetically if MJ ingested propofol and lydocaine himself would it still be considered homicide. “Based on the quality of the medical care, I would still call this a homicide even if the doctor did not administer the propofol to Mr. Jackson,” said Rogers, chief of forensic medication at the Los Angeles County Coroner’s office. He said Murray had endangered Jackson by using the drug in a home setting without proper monitoring, regardless of who gave the final dose. The testimony was a blow to the defense. - Dr. Christopher Rogers testified he believes Dr. Murray had no business administering Propofol outside a hospital setting, particularly without the appropriate medical equipment. Rogers said given MiIchael's dependence on Propofol and the fact that Murray left him alone in the room with access to the drug constitutes a homicide. - Question about self administration : The IV catheter was in the left leg a little bit above the knee. Rogers mentions it's hard to reach and in order of MJ to inject himself it would require the doctor to stop medication, leave the room, MJ wake up and gain the necessary awareness to press /push propofol. - Cross - examination : Oral digestion. Rogers say it's possible to orally digest propofol but doesn't think that's the case here as the amount in the stomach is so small. Dr. Richard Ruffalo Testimony - Ruffalo is an anesthesiologist and clinical pharmacologist. He went over everything about MJ's death and wrote a 47 page independent report. - He says propofol levels in MJ at the time of his death would be even higher as the blood is drawn from him after he received a lot of IV fluids and propofol degrades over time. - Dr, Ruffolo also thinks the numbers of the benzodiazapams from the heart blood, he thinks reflect an injection of a higher dose than what Dr. Murray states he gave. - Dr. Ruffolo mentions monitoring requirements and the equipments and training needed for any emergency situation response. Prosecution Rests in Murray Case - The defense filed a motion to dismiss, which is routine. Closing statements Murray's lawyers arguments - We have never heard the time of death, if we knew the time of death we can find out who is involved. - Murray saw MJ everyday for 3 months, he would know how MJ interacted with these drugs better than the other doctors. - We heard from an anethesiologist what he would use as a standard of care. We didn’t hear from a cardiologist in a similar situation and training. - Murray injected around 10:40 so if Dr. Murray was away from MJ, how could he have given another dose of propofol? so what was going on between 11 am and 12 am? That goes to show you right there that Dr. Murry could not have given that dose, he was on the phone. Prosecutor Walgren's Arguments - Walgren is very angry and passionately in a loud voice, arguing his case. - It was not MJ time to go. MJ's children are without a father.The reason MJ is not here today, is because of the careless, negligence careless incompetence of Murray. MJ is dead at the hands of Murray. - Walgren goes over what is heard in the testimonies. - Walgren mentions Murray's timeline "According to Murray’s own timeline, that he let MJ lie there for over an hour not breathing. Or he could be lying about his timeline, and Murray is not being truthful about his timeline. Third option, is that Dr. Murray is so utterly so incompetent and reckless, that he has no idea what he gave him or when." Judge Pastor's rulings - Judge Pastor denies the defense's motion to dismiss the case. - Walgren asks for an increase in the bail amount. (wants it to be $300,000). Judge denies this as he doesn't think Murray is a flight risk. - Ms. Saunders of Medical board goes over the testimony and asks the judge to suspend Murray's medical licence. Judge grants that request. - Arraignment is set for January 25th, at 8:30 am.
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